The Games Forum: General Discussion

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Re: A New discussion

Post by Bastion » Tue Jun 14, 2011 11:58 pm

KholdStare88 wrote:Supposition: Hurt ≥ Heal implies no ceiling needed, because in the worst case scenario, there is already a ceiling of 5000.
Given Hurt ≥ Heal, T = starting total HP
=> Hurt - Heal ≥ 0
=> T - (Hurt - Heal) ≤ T
For all T, Hurt, Heal in the Natural Numbers, the above statement is true.
=> T is the supremum of the set of all possible total HP.
Since T is included in the set, it is a maximum.
If T is given a value of 5000, then the maximum is 5000.
That is only assuming there is only one person playing. If there is more than one though..
Player 1 heals character A and hurts character B
Player 2 heals character A and hurts character C
Player 3 heals character A and hurts character D
...
Eventually repeating for x number of players, character A is allowed to heal indefinately, while B, C, D etc are eventually taken out. Thus the unfortunate need for a ceiling so that character A does not become a god(ess) and the game becomes a curbstomp, as, even when others are taken out, she is now too powerful for anything less than an equal group of players to take down, which turns the game into 'who can input faster' and confederation vs confederation instead of player vs player.

Even if Player n breaks away and hurts character A instead of the other options, it is little more than a speed bump and doesn't help the enjoyment for anyone not in the confederation.
We actually have a working model of this in Tenshi's performance in ISML this year, she continually wins her matches by large margins and when she didn't get the first necklace, people complained. It's not been seen fully if this continues to be in effect now that she's gotten her necklace for the year.
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Re: A New discussion

Post by Chocola » Wed Jun 15, 2011 12:02 am

No no, character A starts at 100 HP. If every characters are hurt while character A keeps getting healed, but the time character A is left, her HP will be 5000. That's the ceiling.
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Re: A New discussion

Post by superunature » Wed Jun 15, 2011 12:03 am

50 contestants is too much, make it like a tournament
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Re: A New discussion

Post by Alexander » Wed Jun 15, 2011 12:07 am

KholdStare88 wrote:No no, character A starts at 100 HP. If every characters are hurt while character A keeps getting healed, but the time character A is left, her HP will be 5000. That's the ceiling.
Even with that ceilling a character will be able to have like 1/3 of the total HP pool by having more supporters than the others (which will happen since the very beggining), which would ultimately drive new players away when they see that HP, leaving only the veterans to keep playing continuously.
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Re: A New discussion

Post by Chocola » Wed Jun 15, 2011 12:45 am

So the consensus here is that we need a low ceiling. I don't want the ceiling to be the same as the starting HP (100) because the game will end way too fast. If we don't want to use the formula (which I think is best, but requires a moderator to come by every 10 characters), then just use 200.
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Re: A New discussion

Post by Alexander » Wed Jun 15, 2011 12:51 am

I still think the main problem is speed posting.
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Re: A New discussion

Post by Chocola » Wed Jun 15, 2011 12:52 am

We can't control that now can we?
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Re: A New discussion

Post by Momo » Wed Jun 15, 2011 12:56 am

I think 200's a bit low near the end.. Your numbers from before looked find to me, Kholdy..

I suggested a time limit, of sorts, in this post but is that too hard to people to follow?

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Re: A New discussion

Post by Chocola » Wed Jun 15, 2011 1:04 am

Here's what I think. We can use the formula because when 10 characters are reached, it's going to take a while to reach the new limit. In that time, you can PM me so I can come by to formally announce the new limit, and it will be fine. Or you know, the formula is so simple that anyone can calculate the new limit. =/
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Re: A New discussion

Post by Alexander » Wed Jun 15, 2011 1:17 am

I could always get you on irc for that, which is probably going to be faster I think.
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I'd like to propose a new rule. Characters that won on on previous versions of H&H don't participate on other H&H games.
That way there is less characters to start, or a character from previous year's ISML could appear instead.
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Re: A New discussion

Post by chaosprophet » Wed Jun 15, 2011 1:46 am

Alexander wrote:I could always get you on irc for that, which is probably going to be faster I think.
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I'd like to propose a new rule. Characters that won on on previous versions of H&H don't participate on other H&H games.
That way there is less characters to start, or a character from previous year's ISML could appear instead.
If KS isn`t around and I am, you can also ask me to calculate it.
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Re: A New discussion

Post by superunature » Wed Jun 15, 2011 1:52 am

I think discussions on how to set up the game is fun enough already :P
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Re: A New discussion

Post by HeartClover » Wed Jun 15, 2011 1:55 am

^ yeah, it was a good discussion (even though i hardly participated).

so have you all come to a conclusion about the hurt and heal matter?
if so, please summarize what you will do so that we can all be clear about it.


and sorry i had no ideas to contribute.
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Re: A New discussion

Post by Momo » Wed Jun 15, 2011 1:59 am

I think it's something like this with the ceiling a little bit like this

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Re: A New discussion

Post by superunature » Wed Jun 15, 2011 2:01 am

another problem is that, this section of the forum has very few regular visitors, and what we would actually be competing is.....who has less life.
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Re: A New discussion

Post by Alexander » Wed Jun 15, 2011 2:05 am

superunature wrote:another problem is that, this section of the forum has very few regular visitors, and what we would actually be competing is.....who has less life.
Yeah, exactly.
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Re: A New discussion

Post by HeartClover » Wed Jun 15, 2011 2:11 am

Alexander wrote:
superunature wrote:another problem is that, this section of the forum has very few regular visitors, and what we would actually be competing is.....who has less life.
Yeah, exactly.
and then i'll have to hate some of you guys again :P
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Re: A New discussion

Post by Chocola » Wed Jun 15, 2011 2:56 am

So yeah, all theory and no action... We won't know until we try. What do do know is that this time someone's score can't increase to infinity. I have a proposal though before I open the thread. Maybe we can't enforce how many times someone posts a day, but it's really easy to enforce how many times someone can post in one page since it's 20 posts for everyone.

I'm also looking for a forum moderator who will manage the thread to see if anyone is breaking the rules. The person who apply must be trustworthy, determined by me. This moderator will also has the responsibility of editing the first post and add to the ranks when a character has been eliminated.
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Re: A New discussion

Post by superunature » Wed Jun 15, 2011 3:39 am

forum moderator.....wouldn't that be something~
needs to steer some of those people on the other parts of the forum here so it wouldn't be so slow yet not bunch of same people posting over and over again.
guess we can all just have checks and balance over each other~
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Re: A New discussion

Post by Chocola » Wed Jun 15, 2011 4:06 am

Oh come on, I'm offering a moderator post and no one wants it? :P
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